358 ‘ DASA 2019-2 DUNHAM: Let me ask you another question that may sound foolish, but I don't intend it that way. FREMONT-SMITH: ferences. DUNHAM: There are no foolish questions in these con- In these exercises that we were having, are we to con- sider ourselves to have won or lost the war jn conventional terms ? FREMONT-SMITH: Both. DUNHAM: You know what I mean. What's the psychology? Did the Japanese lose and they knew they had lost? Is this situation we're trying to extrapolate to, is-it one in which we lost in the oldfashioned sense and know welost, or is it one in which, in one sense, we won but we're in a hell of a shape? I think this would make a great deal of difference in the motivation for recovery. FREMONT-SMITH: WARREN: And the morale question. I would like to know in that context, too, if we lose, are we invaded and do we have a local official from the foreign government sitting in Washington telling us what to do? TAYLOR: I don't know whether the winners would do it this way but one way they could act as though they had invaded the countryis to have a lot of left-over bombs which would be used to threaten us if we got out of line. Then what would get set up, presumably, would be some provisional governments of which the members would be Russian or Chinese or what have you. What would oe held over us there wouldn't be bayonets but long-range missiles. FREMONT-SMITH: Howabout assuming the simpler one; let's assume that we won and know it. This is at least a little bit easier to work with. Try that out first and after we've settled that one we can move con. SCHULL: In the case of Japan, there was one special problem created by the loss of the war. The Japanese suddenly found themselves obliged to house and feed some six million individuals, civilians and soldiers, compulsorily repatriated from Manchuria, all of south' east Asia, etc. This was 2 sizeable burden to add to an economy which was already hard-pressed. If Japan had won the war, this particular problem would presumably not have arisen,