Gudiksen: Some change and you are talking about a few hundred people per million people exposed. A few hundred cases per million people who get 5 rem. Now then if you take this and go proportional to the number of people on Kili who could live on Bikini Island you are talking about less than one case in 30 years. Ray: Of some genetic change. Gudiksen: Ray: Of some genetic change. _We don't know what that change might be. A few hundred such changes in the city of Denver. Ekpap: Earlier we discussed the food source and you said what I consider to be the three staples of these islands: pandanus, breadfruit and arrowroot --people also preserve these kinds of foods in season for later. I have some questions of you. Are you in position to recommend to the Distad and us how to get some money to provide ourselves food? To get food for our people for the next 10 to 15 years? Ray: Certainly not reasonable to me that some help. Some food the normal process of to make any official recommendations but it seems quite given that condition there needs to come from outside support to the Bikini people and it would go I guess through budgeting with Trust Territory. Am TI right? DeBrum: We asked the same question Ekpap in a number of our meetings. I'm glad you brought it over. The answer is no --- we should all recognize that when it happens and start budgeting for the program. Ekpap: Well Mr. Distad, isn't the present position of USDA food to supply something like this? DeBrum: Right. I know. Nathan: No honestly, the Bikinians right now do see themselves as a community on Kili. If they deliberately decided not to go to Bikini what have we gained and what have we lost from that rehabilitation program on Bikini? After you have funded the development, it's complete. You have made the survey. Can you honestly say it is safe for human habitation now? Ray: Yes, just with the restriction we have mentioned. the restriction on ground water. Restriction on food and Gudiksen: I have a feeling that well water may not be safe to drink from a nonradiation standpoint. Nathan: If you are acting upon it, Congressman Ekpap, recommendations for funding for seasonal foods --- look for more money for transportation of water from Kwajalein to Bikini. I'm sure that island is dry. They used to chew on that pandanus root for water for many times. And if portions of Bikini still hot as a result of fallout... , Gudiksen: I think we do have to mention one proviso: We have not analyzed the water samples yet for radioactivity. We think they may have activity to make it unsafe to drink it but we don't know that for sure yet. It'll be another six months before we have an answer to that. At least the water I saw there was rather brackish type water and I don't think you'd want to drink it anyway. -j]]-